‘I Pray Buhari Is The Last General That Rules Nigeria’ – Bishop Kukah Expresses Disappointment.
A respected Christian cleric and leading voice in national issues, Bishop Mathew Kukah says quite a lot, about a lot of issues affecting Nigeria in this extensive interview with Punch.
Kukah appraises General Muhammadu Buhari’s first year in office as president and suggests solutions to the many agitations in the country.
“National stability is still more crucial than fighting corruption,” Kukah says as he comes close to slamming Buhari’s performance in office.
On Atiku Abubakar’s call for restructuring Nigeria:
There you go. Typical of Nigerians, boarding any bus irrespective of which direction it is heading. If someone just looks at you and says you need surgery, will you just rush to the hospital? Did the former Vice President define what he meant by restructuring? Did he say what parts of the country need restructuring? Did he tell you who would do the restructuring and what their credentials are? Is the restructuring economic, political, psychological, or just another sound bite? The answers he offered are not new. But can we solve our problems by merely changing songs on the dance floor? We have been on these dark alleys of half-truths and innuendos before and we never learn. At the end of military rule, did we not clamour for power shift? Power shift came with former President Olusegun Obasanjo being president along with Atiku. Where did that leave us? Next, we wanted rotation and power went to the South-South. Where has that left us? We believed we needed true federalism as a cure. But the word itself is empty because there is nothing like true federalism anywhere in the world or in the vocabulary. What we have are stories of nations and their toil and sacrifices to build a better society. The north shouted, wailed and cried over the perceived injustice. Then, Change came. Now, it took us less than six months to sink into depression about Change. Now, we can’t seem to spell the word. PDP now says, it wants to Change the Change! We like single words, single stories. I detest our intellectual shallowness, laziness, ineptitude and the lack of analytical discipline. This is why we shall continue to turn in circles with no difference between the quality of ideas from the glass houses of Victoria Island, the ivory towers and those of Ojuelegba bus stop. Atiku flew a political kite which is fine, but it does not scratch the surface of our problems.
On Buhari’s stance on disintegrating Nigeria; Can Nigeria experience peace as one entity?
I don’t like turbulence in the skies. But let me illustrate with an anecdote. It is about a plane that went into turbulent weather. Not unexpectedly, people began to wail and pray. Then, there was this little girl who was running up and down the plane. Someone yanked her off and said: The plane is in turbulence and you are not afraid? She said: I am not afraid of turbulence because my daddy is the pilot! Why do Nigerians panic at the slightest agitation? Agitation, revolt, rebellion, protest, all these are the ingredients of democracy. Democracy is anchored on freedom. How we exercise this and to what purpose is the issue. So, I do not think that the gyrations created by protesters are necessarily to be seen as threats to our democracy. Actually, it is the lack of confidence, the inexperience of the political elite who have found their way into politics without understanding even the most basic principles of Democracy 101 who still think that they can measure progress by how pliant the society is. Indeed, you journalists are not innocent in adding to this confusion. You love sensationalism which tends to be shallow. You would think that all that happened last week at the event in which Atiku spoke was the fact that he spoke about restructuring. The event was actually aimed at giving expression to this freedom and as I saw it, the idea was for people to express themselves freely. The issue is not the expression, it is the duty and the responsibility with which we carry out these activities. I think it is a bit irresponsible for us to continue to talk about the unity of Nigeria. It is like a couple that has been married for over 30 years and they are still wondering whether their marriage will last. There are problems and there will be. Politics is one way of negotiating problems and politicians are supposed to be the mechanics. But here, politics in Nigeria is a like a scene out of the movie, Casino. No rules, just skullduggery and thuggery, no sense of duty or responsibility. The problem is not with Nigerians, but with the abysmal quality of the team selection in the political game in Nigeria. Where is the confidence that should arise from knowing that our father is the pilot?
On the Niger Delta Avengers and Buhari’s ability to weather the storm:
From day one, I said that what we needed was political stability. Nigerians were in a state of euphoria and frenzy over Buhari and APC. In every serious country, the national security adviser’s office is an intellectual office. I have said it over and over. It is the brain box of the nation. But Nigeria, due to our prolonged period of military rule has continued to think that the office belongs to retired soldiers and that security is about looking out for who wants to harm the president or overthrow our government. So, regime security trumps security and welfare of ordinary citizens. The Niger Delta Avengers are the fruits of the harvest of our carelessness and inability to engage in surveillance at a level different from guns, bullets and armoured tanks. They are also the product of our wrong timing and strategy. Could government not have planned well how to deal with the Niger Delta elite, from Mrs. Diezani, Tompolo to others? Again, it is not about fighting corruption, but it is about where all this fits with the overall picture of national stability. There is a serious issue of lack of clarity of sequence in objectives and goals with this administration. There are too many balls in the air which are challenging the dexterity of the government. The so-called Avengers are just taking advantage of a vacuum from lack of strategy and proper sequencing.
The Indigenous People of Biafra and the renewed call for secession:
My view is the same. I argued long time ago that the President needed to develop an apolitical back room and back door channels to address these issues, but the APC government believed that all Nigerians needed was a higher volume of the negative preoccupation with the Jonathan administration. I believed that the IPOB matter could have been ended long time ago. My views are slightly different but they are private and I think we have lost a lot of fuel. Perhaps the military background of the president accounts for his seeing this as a military affair, which has deepened a sense of US vs THEM in what is at best a family matter with your children. Rather than isolating IPOB, we have ended up with a situation in which they now cast themselves in a mould of a metaphor for the Igbo condition. When I speak to my Igbo friends, they condemn IPOB but with caveat, we have no roads, not infrastructure. Thus, the best strategy against IPOB would have been to close those open wounds. Had we not had the happy fall in the senate which enabled Senator Ekwerenmadu to retain his position as deputy senate president, where would the Igbos be in the centre of power in a country where their role, qualifications and contributions are outstandingly clear and glaring? It is not right.
On legitimacy of demands like groups like Niger Delta Avengers and IPOB:
It is not a question of whether demands are legitimate. Everyone should be free to make demands. What is wrong with each member of your family asking you for a car or believing they need a car? If you sit down at table with them and show them your income in honesty, they will understand but it is foolish to say they have no right to ask. A government must improve its listening devices and process every voice, including that of the dumb. Effective security is not based on polishing and turning your guns against your children. Effective security lies in hearing the voices of the voiceless, the weak and the vulnerable, adhering to the principles, that the strength of the chain lies in appreciating the location of the weakest link. I pray that Buhari will be the last general to govern Nigeria. I am tired of this civilian-military when it is clear that a general cannot develop a democratic reflex just by casting a vote. Our democracy must thrive on dissent, contestation, argumentation, negotiation, opposition and consensus. All these are strange in a military mindset and no matter how they try, General Obasanjo and Buhari have shown that turning generals into democrats requires more than a vote. We cannot continue to live in a world in which every disagreement deserves to be punished as we saw with Obasanjo and Na’abba in the House. An attempt at adhering to these principles is one of the reasons why Jonathan was said to be clueless.
On disappointment of Nigerians with the Buhari presidency:
I am convinced that the mistakes are ours, not Buhari’s or even the APC. The APC was free to sell us everything, including a dummy. Buhari never told anyone that he was a magician. It was his acolytes who framed the mantra, SAI BUHARI. In real Hausa, that simply means, no one else can do anything, except Buhari. His handlers placed him on a pantheon and made him a god. Buhari has tried to say he is human, but his acolytes say, no, you cannot come down. We are reaping the fruits of our lazy attitude and expectation that somehow, there will be a knight in shining armour who will come and redeem us without us doing anything. I am still convinced that our country will change, but not because of Buhari as an individual. The day we accept his humanity and its foibles, that day we shall know that governance is more complicated. It demands more than blind, contrived hegemonic hero worshipping.
On Lai Mohammed claiming Buhari has fulfilled his campaign promises:
Well, I cannot answer for others. But, I think you should always trust politicians, but insist and insist on verification. An NGO, Centre for Democracy and Development, has developed the Buharimeter, to measure Buhari’s faithfulness to his promises. I think it is a good place to look. My good friend Lai is correct to say they have fulfilled their promises. It is not his fault if Nigerians do not remember the promises they made in the first place. Sometimes you get the feeling that getting Jonathan out was a goal in itself and now we cannot find the goal post.
The single story of anti-corruption of Buhari’s government:
What do you want me to say? When all this rant started about corruption, I knew that we would get into trouble with this single story culture. I have never changed my position and I knew what I was saying. I called on Buhari to focus on governance, getting the job done with whatever little resources we had. Then as now, I believed that national stability was far more crucial than fighting corruption when it was clear to me that no home work had been done. Most of that is coming through very clearly by the day. Your friends and the miniature fascists that APC had raised ahead of the elections pounced on me on the social media. Those who know better should unfold their long tails which they have locked up between their legs and give the answers. Rather than acknowledging that they were wrong in hoisting their expectations on such a high pole, they are now blaming Buhari. By hanging our hopes on Buhari we are surrendering our own responsibilities. Now, I laugh when I occasionally hear the same people shamelessly say, Bishop Kukah you were a prophet, what did you see that we did not see at that time?
On his relationship with former President Goodluck Jonathan:
I wish it were in all quarters not only in some that people believe I have some sympathy for former President Jonathan. I am proud of my record in being in sympathy with human beings no matter their station. Ninety per cent of my friends know that I am not a perfect friend but I do try to be faithful to friendship. My classmates through school used to joke that any classmate whom I cannot trace must no longer exist. I know the easy options in life especially in a morally dysfunctional country like Nigeria where otherwise respectable men and women behave like prostitutes and move to the next person once things turn. All those who got money from Jonathan today, where are they and where is their sense of honour? They know themselves and I wonder if their consciences prick them. I will cite just four reasons for what you call my sympathy for former President Jonathan. I met him before any of the so-called fly by night friends who befriended him because of their personal greed and the money they made from him. He knows I told him a few truths as I saw things especially regarding our country and its future whenever we met. He showed me a lot of respect. He wrote me personal letters and signed them himself during my 60th birthday and my ordination as a Bishop among others. I first met him on November 4, 2005 and all through to his presidency. So, I had logged enough friendship mileage. Despite all these, not one day did I ask Jonathan to give me a kobo, dollar or euro and he never did. I take integrity seriously. I am a priest of the Catholic Church and I come from over two thousand years of tradition. I am far from perfect, but I try and I love my country. I don’t see what I can exchange for it. If I wanted money, I think I have had the opportunities with all the presidents I have met. I have counted all the opportunities to serve my country as an honour done to me and the church to which I belong.
Secondly, he was the president of my country. I have kept contact with all our former presidents whom I know. It is an honour that they open their doors to me and I cannot take that honour lightly. A president is a president. It is only in Nigeria that hypocrisy blinds us to truth and honesty. Thirdly and perhaps more importantly, I am a priest. Like Fela’s words about Water, I no get enemy. I have never attempted to assess Jonathan’s presidency and it is not for me to do so. Plus, I have not heard his own side of the allegations against him. So, no matter what people say of him, until I have heard him, I will never condemn him. If tomorrow he goes to prison because he committed crimes, I will feel sorry for him but will visit him in prison. I do not abandon my friends no matter their conditions or stations. Those hypocrites who have changed and are wearing jerseys of convenience, who chopped and chopped money under various pretences, they are the men without honour and integrity. Fourthly, I am glad that no less a person than President Buhari has vindicated me by the encomiums he poured on ex President Jonathan. Those who said I was shielding Jonathan because he gave me money should now be honest, they should step forward and ask President Buhari how much Jonathan paid him or what he built for him, if they have a single bone of honesty. President Buhari is a man of honour and he showed that by saying the things he said about Jonathan. Do I feel vindicated? Absolutely. The story is deeper than meets the eye and one day, it will be told. For now, apart from President Buhari and I, there are only four other living people who know the story behind the story.
Is Buhari’s investigation of Jonathan’s administration a witchhunt?
You know, I don’t. But I imagine if he doesn’t, then he has a moral duty to explain to Nigerians.
On FG’s claims to recovered loot:
I have no idea. As you know, despite all the noise about the list, what difference will it make? If we are serious about names, shame and other matters, how many known looters are back on the saddle of power? Has a conviction ever been an excuse for not participating in public life? Apart from the occasional slap in the wrist, have any senior lawyers been barred for misconduct? This country has no moral thermometer. Wait and see the rousing welcome that will await our brother when he returns from prison. Just wait and see and don’t be surprised if he returns to a Senate seat. He will be in good company.
More on Lai Mohammed’s names of looters:
I don’t do fractions so I do not know who the some are. I cannot speculate one way or the other. It should be the duty of the opposition and other concerned people to hold the feet of the government to the fire over their promises and believability.
Can Nigeria ever get a selfless leader?
If you do not appreciate those who have served you to the best of their ability, where will the meritorious service come from? This is at the heart of the dishonesty in the Jonathan bashing. There are people especially in the media and in the churches who celebrated Jonathan, gave awards to his ministers, gave him church honours, blessed him in our prayer camps in exchange for huge sums of money. Now, they do not want to mention Jonathan. Why are journalists not asking questions? Did some rascal not say that Jonathan gave me money to build a house in Sokoto? Were you journalists and social media men and women not baying for my blood? Did you not hear the billions that were said to have been given out for prayers? Why have the noise makers fallen silent? From what I hear, the investigations have fallen silent because they have discovered that some of those who collected money are sacred cows. I hope they have the courage to go the whole hog and collect every penny that Jonathan is said to have given to anyone, no matter their status or station in life. Our doors are open. Is it not a shame that we are the only nation that has no leader that commands our respect after leaving office?
On the role of clergymen in Nigeria:
I am not a lone voice. There are many clergymen who are busy doing different things for the Lord. Some are busy preaching, others prophesying, organising prayer warriors, vigils, running prayer camps for high politicians, casting and binding, selling oil and water, some are fixers for politicians, some in prison, others middlemen for contractors and so on. We are all busy and we cannot all be doing the same thing. Those who are quiet sometimes have difficulty speaking because there is water in their mouth, you never know. But we are busy.
On religious violence and Muslim lynch mobs:
You know our country. It will be the usual noise, threats and promises that it will not happen again. But not much will happen, thanks to the media which will turn away very soon. The issues are serious, but I do not think that government is serious about what to do with these criminal elements since religion is constantly invoked as an excuse. Violence in the name of religion has not been addressed and when some of us call attention, the small minded people say that we hate religion. But we cannot go on like this. We Christians continue to appeal for calm, but there is a limit to how much this can go on. Muslims may be majority in Kano, but they are not in Akwa Ibom. Christians may be majority in Onitsha, but they are not in Katsina. The real challenge is how a weak nation has refused to compel citizens to live under one single law. But this is not the first time this is happening. We had the case of Gideon in Kano, we had the case of a young lady who was assaulted in Ahmadu Bello University, Zaria, on grounds that she was having her bath outside during a blackout, we had the case of a young man who was slaughtered in Tafawa Balewa University by Muslim youths on the grounds that he blasphemed. We have a case of one of my parishioners here who was physically assaulted on grounds that he was wearing a religious insignia. What is blasphemy and who gave anyone the right to be God’s judge? What law are we operating under? These are the larger questions that will not be addressed and we shall lie low, pretend that we have made peace and wait for the fire next time. The political class chooses political exigency instead of courage.
On National Grazing Reserves:
I think we should do some self examination and ask ourselves how and why is it that we allowed our people to continue some outdated system of hazardous occupation that place our citizens in harm’s way in dangerous environments? Who is still travelling hundreds of miles across lands and waters in the name of grazing? The northern political elite must face this problem squarely because it relates to how they have left millions of their people behind a twilight zone of development. I think most people suggest that creating ranches makes better economic sense. The political elite in the north must respond to this issue quickly and carefully so as to restore respect and avoid endangering the lives of ordinary people who remain vulnerable.
On the many revolts against Buhari:
I am generally worried with the way the president has tried to deal with the problems of revolts across the country. He has opened up too many flanks and I fear that it will affect his concentration on the larger issues. Again, some of the fire-fighters he could have used are involved in other fights. Unlike Obasanjo, President Buhari has not had an active social life across the divide and this is what is causing the problems for him. He does not have too many telephone numbers of people he has known for a long time that he can call at 2am for old times’ sake. His knowledge of the Nigerian cultural and social mix is quite limited. He seems to have too tiny a circle of people he can fall back on to do the heavy lifting behind the scenes. This is the challenge.
On medical tourism by Nigerian leaders:
Ask the doctors. I have no idea. I only worry that too many of our big men and women are leaving their health footprints in foreign lands. It is not good for our security at all. It is a measure of how vulnerable we are. We owe our president our prayers in his time of need. We should not play politics with the health of anyone, not least our president.
On God’s anger against Nigerians:
What does an angry God look like? I think God is happy with over 90% of ordinary Nigerians who are doing their best to live a good life, are praying to Him and singing His praises every day. He needed only 10 to save Sodom and Gomorrah. He can find 169 million righteous Nigerians any day. He knows it. This is a great country, part of God’s choice real estate.
From Punch.
Kukah appraises General Muhammadu Buhari’s first year in office as president and suggests solutions to the many agitations in the country.
“National stability is still more crucial than fighting corruption,” Kukah says as he comes close to slamming Buhari’s performance in office.
On Atiku Abubakar’s call for restructuring Nigeria:
There you go. Typical of Nigerians, boarding any bus irrespective of which direction it is heading. If someone just looks at you and says you need surgery, will you just rush to the hospital? Did the former Vice President define what he meant by restructuring? Did he say what parts of the country need restructuring? Did he tell you who would do the restructuring and what their credentials are? Is the restructuring economic, political, psychological, or just another sound bite? The answers he offered are not new. But can we solve our problems by merely changing songs on the dance floor? We have been on these dark alleys of half-truths and innuendos before and we never learn. At the end of military rule, did we not clamour for power shift? Power shift came with former President Olusegun Obasanjo being president along with Atiku. Where did that leave us? Next, we wanted rotation and power went to the South-South. Where has that left us? We believed we needed true federalism as a cure. But the word itself is empty because there is nothing like true federalism anywhere in the world or in the vocabulary. What we have are stories of nations and their toil and sacrifices to build a better society. The north shouted, wailed and cried over the perceived injustice. Then, Change came. Now, it took us less than six months to sink into depression about Change. Now, we can’t seem to spell the word. PDP now says, it wants to Change the Change! We like single words, single stories. I detest our intellectual shallowness, laziness, ineptitude and the lack of analytical discipline. This is why we shall continue to turn in circles with no difference between the quality of ideas from the glass houses of Victoria Island, the ivory towers and those of Ojuelegba bus stop. Atiku flew a political kite which is fine, but it does not scratch the surface of our problems.
On Buhari’s stance on disintegrating Nigeria; Can Nigeria experience peace as one entity?
I don’t like turbulence in the skies. But let me illustrate with an anecdote. It is about a plane that went into turbulent weather. Not unexpectedly, people began to wail and pray. Then, there was this little girl who was running up and down the plane. Someone yanked her off and said: The plane is in turbulence and you are not afraid? She said: I am not afraid of turbulence because my daddy is the pilot! Why do Nigerians panic at the slightest agitation? Agitation, revolt, rebellion, protest, all these are the ingredients of democracy. Democracy is anchored on freedom. How we exercise this and to what purpose is the issue. So, I do not think that the gyrations created by protesters are necessarily to be seen as threats to our democracy. Actually, it is the lack of confidence, the inexperience of the political elite who have found their way into politics without understanding even the most basic principles of Democracy 101 who still think that they can measure progress by how pliant the society is. Indeed, you journalists are not innocent in adding to this confusion. You love sensationalism which tends to be shallow. You would think that all that happened last week at the event in which Atiku spoke was the fact that he spoke about restructuring. The event was actually aimed at giving expression to this freedom and as I saw it, the idea was for people to express themselves freely. The issue is not the expression, it is the duty and the responsibility with which we carry out these activities. I think it is a bit irresponsible for us to continue to talk about the unity of Nigeria. It is like a couple that has been married for over 30 years and they are still wondering whether their marriage will last. There are problems and there will be. Politics is one way of negotiating problems and politicians are supposed to be the mechanics. But here, politics in Nigeria is a like a scene out of the movie, Casino. No rules, just skullduggery and thuggery, no sense of duty or responsibility. The problem is not with Nigerians, but with the abysmal quality of the team selection in the political game in Nigeria. Where is the confidence that should arise from knowing that our father is the pilot?
On the Niger Delta Avengers and Buhari’s ability to weather the storm:
From day one, I said that what we needed was political stability. Nigerians were in a state of euphoria and frenzy over Buhari and APC. In every serious country, the national security adviser’s office is an intellectual office. I have said it over and over. It is the brain box of the nation. But Nigeria, due to our prolonged period of military rule has continued to think that the office belongs to retired soldiers and that security is about looking out for who wants to harm the president or overthrow our government. So, regime security trumps security and welfare of ordinary citizens. The Niger Delta Avengers are the fruits of the harvest of our carelessness and inability to engage in surveillance at a level different from guns, bullets and armoured tanks. They are also the product of our wrong timing and strategy. Could government not have planned well how to deal with the Niger Delta elite, from Mrs. Diezani, Tompolo to others? Again, it is not about fighting corruption, but it is about where all this fits with the overall picture of national stability. There is a serious issue of lack of clarity of sequence in objectives and goals with this administration. There are too many balls in the air which are challenging the dexterity of the government. The so-called Avengers are just taking advantage of a vacuum from lack of strategy and proper sequencing.
The Indigenous People of Biafra and the renewed call for secession:
My view is the same. I argued long time ago that the President needed to develop an apolitical back room and back door channels to address these issues, but the APC government believed that all Nigerians needed was a higher volume of the negative preoccupation with the Jonathan administration. I believed that the IPOB matter could have been ended long time ago. My views are slightly different but they are private and I think we have lost a lot of fuel. Perhaps the military background of the president accounts for his seeing this as a military affair, which has deepened a sense of US vs THEM in what is at best a family matter with your children. Rather than isolating IPOB, we have ended up with a situation in which they now cast themselves in a mould of a metaphor for the Igbo condition. When I speak to my Igbo friends, they condemn IPOB but with caveat, we have no roads, not infrastructure. Thus, the best strategy against IPOB would have been to close those open wounds. Had we not had the happy fall in the senate which enabled Senator Ekwerenmadu to retain his position as deputy senate president, where would the Igbos be in the centre of power in a country where their role, qualifications and contributions are outstandingly clear and glaring? It is not right.
On legitimacy of demands like groups like Niger Delta Avengers and IPOB:
It is not a question of whether demands are legitimate. Everyone should be free to make demands. What is wrong with each member of your family asking you for a car or believing they need a car? If you sit down at table with them and show them your income in honesty, they will understand but it is foolish to say they have no right to ask. A government must improve its listening devices and process every voice, including that of the dumb. Effective security is not based on polishing and turning your guns against your children. Effective security lies in hearing the voices of the voiceless, the weak and the vulnerable, adhering to the principles, that the strength of the chain lies in appreciating the location of the weakest link. I pray that Buhari will be the last general to govern Nigeria. I am tired of this civilian-military when it is clear that a general cannot develop a democratic reflex just by casting a vote. Our democracy must thrive on dissent, contestation, argumentation, negotiation, opposition and consensus. All these are strange in a military mindset and no matter how they try, General Obasanjo and Buhari have shown that turning generals into democrats requires more than a vote. We cannot continue to live in a world in which every disagreement deserves to be punished as we saw with Obasanjo and Na’abba in the House. An attempt at adhering to these principles is one of the reasons why Jonathan was said to be clueless.
On disappointment of Nigerians with the Buhari presidency:
I am convinced that the mistakes are ours, not Buhari’s or even the APC. The APC was free to sell us everything, including a dummy. Buhari never told anyone that he was a magician. It was his acolytes who framed the mantra, SAI BUHARI. In real Hausa, that simply means, no one else can do anything, except Buhari. His handlers placed him on a pantheon and made him a god. Buhari has tried to say he is human, but his acolytes say, no, you cannot come down. We are reaping the fruits of our lazy attitude and expectation that somehow, there will be a knight in shining armour who will come and redeem us without us doing anything. I am still convinced that our country will change, but not because of Buhari as an individual. The day we accept his humanity and its foibles, that day we shall know that governance is more complicated. It demands more than blind, contrived hegemonic hero worshipping.
On Lai Mohammed claiming Buhari has fulfilled his campaign promises:
Well, I cannot answer for others. But, I think you should always trust politicians, but insist and insist on verification. An NGO, Centre for Democracy and Development, has developed the Buharimeter, to measure Buhari’s faithfulness to his promises. I think it is a good place to look. My good friend Lai is correct to say they have fulfilled their promises. It is not his fault if Nigerians do not remember the promises they made in the first place. Sometimes you get the feeling that getting Jonathan out was a goal in itself and now we cannot find the goal post.
The single story of anti-corruption of Buhari’s government:
What do you want me to say? When all this rant started about corruption, I knew that we would get into trouble with this single story culture. I have never changed my position and I knew what I was saying. I called on Buhari to focus on governance, getting the job done with whatever little resources we had. Then as now, I believed that national stability was far more crucial than fighting corruption when it was clear to me that no home work had been done. Most of that is coming through very clearly by the day. Your friends and the miniature fascists that APC had raised ahead of the elections pounced on me on the social media. Those who know better should unfold their long tails which they have locked up between their legs and give the answers. Rather than acknowledging that they were wrong in hoisting their expectations on such a high pole, they are now blaming Buhari. By hanging our hopes on Buhari we are surrendering our own responsibilities. Now, I laugh when I occasionally hear the same people shamelessly say, Bishop Kukah you were a prophet, what did you see that we did not see at that time?
On his relationship with former President Goodluck Jonathan:
I wish it were in all quarters not only in some that people believe I have some sympathy for former President Jonathan. I am proud of my record in being in sympathy with human beings no matter their station. Ninety per cent of my friends know that I am not a perfect friend but I do try to be faithful to friendship. My classmates through school used to joke that any classmate whom I cannot trace must no longer exist. I know the easy options in life especially in a morally dysfunctional country like Nigeria where otherwise respectable men and women behave like prostitutes and move to the next person once things turn. All those who got money from Jonathan today, where are they and where is their sense of honour? They know themselves and I wonder if their consciences prick them. I will cite just four reasons for what you call my sympathy for former President Jonathan. I met him before any of the so-called fly by night friends who befriended him because of their personal greed and the money they made from him. He knows I told him a few truths as I saw things especially regarding our country and its future whenever we met. He showed me a lot of respect. He wrote me personal letters and signed them himself during my 60th birthday and my ordination as a Bishop among others. I first met him on November 4, 2005 and all through to his presidency. So, I had logged enough friendship mileage. Despite all these, not one day did I ask Jonathan to give me a kobo, dollar or euro and he never did. I take integrity seriously. I am a priest of the Catholic Church and I come from over two thousand years of tradition. I am far from perfect, but I try and I love my country. I don’t see what I can exchange for it. If I wanted money, I think I have had the opportunities with all the presidents I have met. I have counted all the opportunities to serve my country as an honour done to me and the church to which I belong.
Secondly, he was the president of my country. I have kept contact with all our former presidents whom I know. It is an honour that they open their doors to me and I cannot take that honour lightly. A president is a president. It is only in Nigeria that hypocrisy blinds us to truth and honesty. Thirdly and perhaps more importantly, I am a priest. Like Fela’s words about Water, I no get enemy. I have never attempted to assess Jonathan’s presidency and it is not for me to do so. Plus, I have not heard his own side of the allegations against him. So, no matter what people say of him, until I have heard him, I will never condemn him. If tomorrow he goes to prison because he committed crimes, I will feel sorry for him but will visit him in prison. I do not abandon my friends no matter their conditions or stations. Those hypocrites who have changed and are wearing jerseys of convenience, who chopped and chopped money under various pretences, they are the men without honour and integrity. Fourthly, I am glad that no less a person than President Buhari has vindicated me by the encomiums he poured on ex President Jonathan. Those who said I was shielding Jonathan because he gave me money should now be honest, they should step forward and ask President Buhari how much Jonathan paid him or what he built for him, if they have a single bone of honesty. President Buhari is a man of honour and he showed that by saying the things he said about Jonathan. Do I feel vindicated? Absolutely. The story is deeper than meets the eye and one day, it will be told. For now, apart from President Buhari and I, there are only four other living people who know the story behind the story.
Is Buhari’s investigation of Jonathan’s administration a witchhunt?
You know, I don’t. But I imagine if he doesn’t, then he has a moral duty to explain to Nigerians.
On FG’s claims to recovered loot:
I have no idea. As you know, despite all the noise about the list, what difference will it make? If we are serious about names, shame and other matters, how many known looters are back on the saddle of power? Has a conviction ever been an excuse for not participating in public life? Apart from the occasional slap in the wrist, have any senior lawyers been barred for misconduct? This country has no moral thermometer. Wait and see the rousing welcome that will await our brother when he returns from prison. Just wait and see and don’t be surprised if he returns to a Senate seat. He will be in good company.
More on Lai Mohammed’s names of looters:
I don’t do fractions so I do not know who the some are. I cannot speculate one way or the other. It should be the duty of the opposition and other concerned people to hold the feet of the government to the fire over their promises and believability.
Can Nigeria ever get a selfless leader?
If you do not appreciate those who have served you to the best of their ability, where will the meritorious service come from? This is at the heart of the dishonesty in the Jonathan bashing. There are people especially in the media and in the churches who celebrated Jonathan, gave awards to his ministers, gave him church honours, blessed him in our prayer camps in exchange for huge sums of money. Now, they do not want to mention Jonathan. Why are journalists not asking questions? Did some rascal not say that Jonathan gave me money to build a house in Sokoto? Were you journalists and social media men and women not baying for my blood? Did you not hear the billions that were said to have been given out for prayers? Why have the noise makers fallen silent? From what I hear, the investigations have fallen silent because they have discovered that some of those who collected money are sacred cows. I hope they have the courage to go the whole hog and collect every penny that Jonathan is said to have given to anyone, no matter their status or station in life. Our doors are open. Is it not a shame that we are the only nation that has no leader that commands our respect after leaving office?
On the role of clergymen in Nigeria:
I am not a lone voice. There are many clergymen who are busy doing different things for the Lord. Some are busy preaching, others prophesying, organising prayer warriors, vigils, running prayer camps for high politicians, casting and binding, selling oil and water, some are fixers for politicians, some in prison, others middlemen for contractors and so on. We are all busy and we cannot all be doing the same thing. Those who are quiet sometimes have difficulty speaking because there is water in their mouth, you never know. But we are busy.
On religious violence and Muslim lynch mobs:
You know our country. It will be the usual noise, threats and promises that it will not happen again. But not much will happen, thanks to the media which will turn away very soon. The issues are serious, but I do not think that government is serious about what to do with these criminal elements since religion is constantly invoked as an excuse. Violence in the name of religion has not been addressed and when some of us call attention, the small minded people say that we hate religion. But we cannot go on like this. We Christians continue to appeal for calm, but there is a limit to how much this can go on. Muslims may be majority in Kano, but they are not in Akwa Ibom. Christians may be majority in Onitsha, but they are not in Katsina. The real challenge is how a weak nation has refused to compel citizens to live under one single law. But this is not the first time this is happening. We had the case of Gideon in Kano, we had the case of a young lady who was assaulted in Ahmadu Bello University, Zaria, on grounds that she was having her bath outside during a blackout, we had the case of a young man who was slaughtered in Tafawa Balewa University by Muslim youths on the grounds that he blasphemed. We have a case of one of my parishioners here who was physically assaulted on grounds that he was wearing a religious insignia. What is blasphemy and who gave anyone the right to be God’s judge? What law are we operating under? These are the larger questions that will not be addressed and we shall lie low, pretend that we have made peace and wait for the fire next time. The political class chooses political exigency instead of courage.
On National Grazing Reserves:
I think we should do some self examination and ask ourselves how and why is it that we allowed our people to continue some outdated system of hazardous occupation that place our citizens in harm’s way in dangerous environments? Who is still travelling hundreds of miles across lands and waters in the name of grazing? The northern political elite must face this problem squarely because it relates to how they have left millions of their people behind a twilight zone of development. I think most people suggest that creating ranches makes better economic sense. The political elite in the north must respond to this issue quickly and carefully so as to restore respect and avoid endangering the lives of ordinary people who remain vulnerable.
On the many revolts against Buhari:
I am generally worried with the way the president has tried to deal with the problems of revolts across the country. He has opened up too many flanks and I fear that it will affect his concentration on the larger issues. Again, some of the fire-fighters he could have used are involved in other fights. Unlike Obasanjo, President Buhari has not had an active social life across the divide and this is what is causing the problems for him. He does not have too many telephone numbers of people he has known for a long time that he can call at 2am for old times’ sake. His knowledge of the Nigerian cultural and social mix is quite limited. He seems to have too tiny a circle of people he can fall back on to do the heavy lifting behind the scenes. This is the challenge.
On medical tourism by Nigerian leaders:
Ask the doctors. I have no idea. I only worry that too many of our big men and women are leaving their health footprints in foreign lands. It is not good for our security at all. It is a measure of how vulnerable we are. We owe our president our prayers in his time of need. We should not play politics with the health of anyone, not least our president.
On God’s anger against Nigerians:
What does an angry God look like? I think God is happy with over 90% of ordinary Nigerians who are doing their best to live a good life, are praying to Him and singing His praises every day. He needed only 10 to save Sodom and Gomorrah. He can find 169 million righteous Nigerians any day. He knows it. This is a great country, part of God’s choice real estate.
From Punch.
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